Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Share strategy and tips here.
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

My struggle with assault is that in begining of mission, assault can do so little as normally there are pods within LOS of each other. Hence you are 1 man down the first few turns of the mission.
While arc throw do offer some control, a psi stasis offer the same with 100% certainty.

I do need to admit that I do not have much experience with late game assault as I stop using them after a near squad wipe due to bad activation.

With all the advices given, I will be taking an asaualt out for a spin today. Let see how the mission go.
Zork
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:58 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Zork »

Dong101 wrote:While arc throw do offer some control, a psi stasis offer the same with 100% certainty.
You never ever used Arc Lightning or you wouldn't wrote that.
NOT a tactical/strategy expert player, playing LW2 at Easy. Rather old so I appreciate not be bothered by excessive familiarity, I'm not your friend and will never be. Refuse to learn English well so don't attempt learn it to me, thank you. :-)
Zork
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:58 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Zork »

hamds28 wrote:I would bring 2 rangers and 1 assault over 3 rangers, even before the Tech Sergeant level. With the exception of Shinobi, no one else can run suppression and waste enemy OW, crit harder and more consistently, and reach hard to kill enemies like an assault. They aren't built to dish out consistent damage until the late midgame, but they do pull their weight on my GOps teams, Network Towers and Troop Columns.
Why use an Assault over a Shinobi, because you persistently achieve apply good AoE or use significantly Arc Thrower. Frequent AOE damages is the only chance of an Assault to counter balance Reaper. For close range damages Assault don't do better than Shinobi. And for my knowledge, and attract new pods, they are totally equivalent and no way such damages Assault attract less pods than a Shinobi.

That's why with my knowledge the only Assault I find really useful are those build around Arc thrower and those allowing me diversify tactical play but not to make it more efficient, just different for the fun.

What let's play shows frequent persistent uses of Assault AOE? I have yet to see one. I watch one where the player definitely like Assault and apply AOE, and it's often spectacular when done, but no way it's persistent, more rare. If an Assault can't apply efficient AOE it is no match with a Shinobi, here the problem for me and for my knowledge level.
NOT a tactical/strategy expert player, playing LW2 at Easy. Rather old so I appreciate not be bothered by excessive familiarity, I'm not your friend and will never be. Refuse to learn English well so don't attempt learn it to me, thank you. :-)
Zork
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:58 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Zork »

stefan3iii wrote:
Zork wrote: Well I can play with 3 Rangers, Rangers have both strongest OW builds and strongest Shoot builds. I don't see how Assault can compete with that, with their close range they are a lot more contextual and quite more than Shinobi.

I have to see any let's play showing regular uses of Shotgun skills, some great uses sure, not constant persistent use, that means it's quite contextual.
Shotguns do more damage, and assaults are much better at critting at close range. So when an assault is actually hitting, they tend to do more damage than a ranger. Sometimes you can't hit anything with an assault, because you can't move close enough and risk activation, but on average they're as good or better than rangers.

That said I think both classes are good. Rangers need more support in early and mid game. They want team members that can destroy cover, and they benefit greatly from a +Damage ammo like Stiletto. Assaults are just solid the whole game, and are the strongest class specifically at TSGT I think.
Rangers are great no matter the context, beginning, middle, end game, past end game. And no matter the mission, ok except pure Stealth mission I don't bother play. That's why I quoted the 3 rangers thing, to answer your comment: "Assaults are still the best/most consistent soldier class in LW2 from early game to late game." that I quite disagree with, but again the context is my knowledge level which includes that Assault AOE are very rare no matter my efforts to try pool them.

One point is ok for rush forward missions, small pods, you don't bother attract new pods, then ok perhaps Assault could replace with profit a Ranger. But is it really better than using another Shinobi, frankly I think I'd prefer 3 Shinobi and 3 AOE for such approach. All the problem comes from enemies spreading too much and too much fanatic of full cover for the Assault AoE.
NOT a tactical/strategy expert player, playing LW2 at Easy. Rather old so I appreciate not be bothered by excessive familiarity, I'm not your friend and will never be. Refuse to learn English well so don't attempt learn it to me, thank you. :-)
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

Zork wrote:
Dong101 wrote:While arc throw do offer some control, a psi stasis offer the same with 100% certainty.
You never ever used Arc Lightning or you wouldn't wrote that.
I did saw some LP video on that. Very nice, training 1 now. :D
Zork
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:58 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Zork »

Dong101 wrote:
Zork wrote:
Dong101 wrote:While arc throw do offer some control, a psi stasis offer the same with 100% certainty.
You never ever used Arc Lightning or you wouldn't wrote that.
I did saw some LP video on that. Very nice, training 1 now. :D
:-) First time I used it was rather incredible, pod not finished, two other pods attracted by Assault blue move, Arc Lighting (not initially planed) dropped from my chair to see the mass of enemies stunned including some enemies almost out of vision range. The skill morphed a disastrous context into a dominating one. It's better plan your Arc Lighting, but the option for unexpected pods attracted, is definitely one of the good option of such Assault with Arc Lightning.

I like Assault but for now only for his Arc Thrower and because Assault allow use different tactics, different but not better for me.
NOT a tactical/strategy expert player, playing LW2 at Easy. Rather old so I appreciate not be bothered by excessive familiarity, I'm not your friend and will never be. Refuse to learn English well so don't attempt learn it to me, thank you. :-)
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

Finally all those assaualt I placed in Havan paid off.

Icepick the fearless assault managed to take down 5 faceless with help from the haven personnel. And 2 MECs, these are bullets magnet.
LordYanaek
Posts: 940
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:34 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by LordYanaek »

Assaults are very good haven advisor. Trench gun usually allows you to remove the first pod with a single action, making sure you don't get to fight both pods at once which can happen if they were close by and is usually the only dangerous situation during RDV. R&G is also very good for taking an officer who insists on staying in full cover. Finally the stun gun is nice when your rebels on elevated position all graze the approaching faceless and you don't want him to jump on the roof and destroy it when attacking.
Icarus
Posts: 151
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:26 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Icarus »

Regarding non-arc assaults: lightning reflexes clears overwatches for the whole group, in contrast to the shinobis shadowstep which only protects the soldier. This is a very important use case in missions where you need to move and don't have the resources to flashbang everything. And it only costs you a move action you were probably going to take anyway, in contrast to most other OW clearing.
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

Icarus wrote:Regarding non-arc assaults: lightning reflexes clears overwatches for the whole group, in contrast to the shinobis shadowstep which only protects the soldier. This is a very important use case in missions where you need to move and don't have the resources to flashbang everything. And it only costs you a move action you were probably going to take anyway, in contrast to most other OW clearing.
I try to avoid running multiple OW with LR assault. Too many painful memory from LW1. Is LR work better in LW2?
Steelflame
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:35 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Steelflame »

Dong101 wrote:
Icarus wrote:Regarding non-arc assaults: lightning reflexes clears overwatches for the whole group, in contrast to the shinobis shadowstep which only protects the soldier. This is a very important use case in missions where you need to move and don't have the resources to flashbang everything. And it only costs you a move action you were probably going to take anyway, in contrast to most other OW clearing.
I try to avoid running multiple OW with LR assault. Too many painful memory from LW1. Is LR work better in LW2?
It still has the same diminishing returns system (First shot is +100 defense, each one after is -20. If your Assault has decent base defense, you can effectively extend your safe OW run by 1.)


For the most part, so long as you are not running 4 or more OW shots, you should be fine to run them with an Assault with LR. Any situation where you might have to run more you should have been solving with a rapid fire Flashbang anyway.
bingo12345
Posts: 76
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 8:13 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by bingo12345 »

Dong101 wrote:I am way under utilize the assault in my game. After tiggering addition pod too many times, I stop bringing assault on mission.

I read thst they are good. But in my game, I always find them more of a burden due to lower mid to long range aim. Often I need to move them close butcend up triggering additional pods.

While arc thrower is nice, I find psi is better in lock down single target and offer other utilities skills that help the squard every turn.

Now all my assault become haven advicers :roll:
Just use shinobi and battle scanners. No additional enemies!

Use assault only in side of map. If you move your assault to center of map, you cant avoid addtional enemies.
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

Finally get an Assault to MSgt. Chain lighthing is just, WOW! It hit every stunable aliens in LOS and never miss.

Now I bring 2 assault for every smash an graps.
jorgen_cab
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:11 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by jorgen_cab »

For me there is only one type of Assault that I currently use and that is Electroshock, Close and Personal, Stun Gunner, Formidable, Close Encounters, Close Combat Specialist, Chain Lightning.

I usually only have a few Assaults and add them to squads as they engage in more difficult missions where their control and destruction capabilities are more important.

The Assault simply fill a specific role in these squads and by no means does this mean I think other combinations are not good or viable, I simply don't need anything else.

Stats that are important are Movement 15-16, Health 4+ and Aim at least 65+. I basically think the original baseline Rookie stats are perfect for an Assault.

The use I have for the Assault is basically to control and sweep the battlefield as I engage the opponent. The Arc Thrower can break or suppress pretty much any power at will which can be important when larger or multiple pods are revealed in combination with flash bangs and suppression. Once the enemy have been thinned down the Assault help with finishing of the enemy. High ranking Assault are just amazing at crowd control and clean up duty. They also serve well as Haven advisors when they are not doing missions.
Last edited by jorgen_cab on Fri Nov 10, 2017 1:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
Dwarfling
Posts: 524
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2017 12:16 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dwarfling »

I don't know how you can play 1.5 without Lightning Reflexes. Overwatches are eeeeeverywhere and even if you only have 1 overwatch to get rid of, you want the assault to keep on the move. Even my 13 mobility assaults pack it. Electroshock is weaksauce compared to it, given that a high aim assault with Stun Gunner has a reliable stun chance even against targets in cover.
jorgen_cab
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:11 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by jorgen_cab »

Dwarfling wrote:I don't know how you can play 1.5 without Lightning Reflexes. Overwatches are eeeeeverywhere and even if you only have 1 overwatch to get rid of, you want the assault to keep on the move. Even my 13 mobility assaults pack it. Electroshock is weaksauce compared to it, given that a high aim assault with Stun Gunner has a reliable stun chance even against targets in cover.
Flashbangs, grenades and suppression in addition to the stun of the Assault is enough to not bother that much about overwatch.

This is a squad effort and I never missed lightning reflexes and at least my Shinobies get shadowwalk so they ignore it when needed. I suppose that no class work as an isolated piece but as part of a whole in the squad dynamic. In each squad you need the ability to deal with many different issues and are composed to beat those obstacles together.

I try and keep all of my squads somewhat generic with some small differences on standard guerrilla ops where you start concealed or not and other harder missions.

At the start of the game I tend to form my squads into a few permanent 5 man team and one or two 2 man teams. Soldiers are then added to these permanent teams as needed based on the mission. The 2 man teams usually perform ops that is stealth only and consist of a Shinobi and a Ranger with adding either a Specialist or Sharpshooter based on the mission. The Ranger are simply there to cover the team if things go wrong while they bail or to cover the retreat after the mission objective is done.

I tend to have a lot of soldiers and go on MANY missions
Last edited by jorgen_cab on Thu Nov 09, 2017 7:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dwarfling
Posts: 524
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2017 12:16 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dwarfling »

I fail to see your point about why you're taking Electroshock over Lightning Reflexes. What contributes more to the team effort, a soldier that can disorient a single target (if it misses) or one that can dispel overwatches for the whole team, FOR FREE, allowing it to take better positions?
jorgen_cab
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:11 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by jorgen_cab »

Dwarfling wrote:I fail to see your point about why you're taking Electroshock over Lightning Reflexes. What contributes more to the team effort, a soldier that can disorient a single target (if it misses) or one that can dispel overwatches for the whole team, FOR FREE, allowing it to take better positions?
I can effortlessly end mind control and suppress other abilities I don't want used. This is more important when I can deal with overwatches from almost every team member in some way in the early or mid game. Late game that Assault deal with pretty much ANY problems since they basically either stun or disorient everything in sight.

I would also add that Lightning Reflexes is not free, there is a chance you still get hit and that happen too often if relied upon much in my opinion.
Padishar
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:26 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Padishar »

Dwarfling wrote:I fail to see your point about why you're taking Electroshock over Lightning Reflexes. What contributes more to the team effort, a soldier that can disorient a single target (if it misses) or one that can dispel overwatches for the whole team, FOR FREE, allowing it to take better positions?
Disorient is much more than removing overwatch. I prefer Electroshock on very low-aim assaults.

There are also many many ways of clearing overwatch. It all depends on the class builds, team composition, and how many flashbangs the player brings to missions. Someone can also play with a style that doesn't make the enemy OW that much, but another tactic could do the opposite, at which point Lightning Reflexes is a very desirable perk.
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

Affer spending sometime playing using assault, I find that I like electroshock more that LR.

I find chain lighthing work well with electroscock. When you need CL most is likely because there ard too many threats to be handle by your team. So any miss that turn into disorient is welcome.

LR still got it used, I have both spec'ed but LR assault mostly is used in S&G. For big fight, electroshock/CL assault will be the one I prefered.
Psieye
Posts: 829
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:27 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Psieye »

I find it weird for S&G to NOT be considered a big fight. But as has been pointed out before, how you value Electroshock vs LR comes down to what the rest of your barracks are up to - your overall doctrine. If you focus on small fights then there's reason to value Electroshock. If you consider 15 active enemies to be Situation Normal, you'll want to buff the LR assault with an Aid Prot.
My three 8-man GOp squad Commander campaigns:
1st
2nd
3rd
Dong101
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 1:03 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Dong101 »

S&G -smash and grabs. How could that be big fight unless you purposely under infiltrate the mission? Normally this is very light to light in my game.

I kimd of prefer LR for small mission where I can run overwatch to take out key threat fast while keep the momemtum going. Electroshock is more to enhance Chain Lightning in multiple threats situation, basically that my "oh shit! Button".

But I am still new to this game and may be with more play I will value them differently.
Psieye
Posts: 829
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:27 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by Psieye »

That's my point - what's the point in infiltrating S&Gs fully once you can handle 25+ enemies? I don't see the value in Chain Lightning, but then again I consider activated (read: predictable) enemies to be controlled if I've positioned my squad correctly. There are few enemies in a pod I consider 'uncontrolled while predictable'. Thus I want my assaults to be killing 2~3 things every turn without taking wounds. It's harder to do that when they're spec'd for a good Chain Lightning.
My three 8-man GOp squad Commander campaigns:
1st
2nd
3rd
User avatar
SonnyWiFiHr
Posts: 416
Joined: Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:57 pm

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by SonnyWiFiHr »

LR - for any build.
If I forgot to give them Lighting Reflexes they end up dead. So I make sure that LR is there (for my sanity)
If they did not level up to get LR. I have to write it down. I prefer them alive and removing OW without LR ( it happens) is goodbye Assault.

There should be red flashing icon for non lighting reflexes assault . HALT you are missing LR

In that case maybe I try different perk.
Rest of the perks - there is guide for that and I have no objections about builds.

There should be red flashing icon for non lighting reflexes assault ACROSS WHOLE SCREEN . HALT you are missing LR
The Preacher
jorgen_cab
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:11 am

Re: Assault class - how to effectively used them?

Post by jorgen_cab »

Psieye wrote:That's my point - what's the point in infiltrating S&Gs fully once you can handle 25+ enemies? I don't see the value in Chain Lightning, but then again I consider activated (read: predictable) enemies to be controlled if I've positioned my squad correctly. There are few enemies in a pod I consider 'uncontrolled while predictable'. Thus I want my assaults to be killing 2~3 things every turn without taking wounds. It's harder to do that when they're spec'd for a good Chain Lightning.
To be honest your style are a bit exploitative of the mechanics and make the whole infiltration mechanic sort of pointless which is why I don't harvest XP that way. For me it is a balance issue and one I happily handicap myself not to exploit the same why I try to avoid exploiting the combat AI where it usually derp out.

Instead I make sure I have a wide rooster and time to infiltrate with less soldiers and/or less experienced soldiers with MUCH fewer enemies. It also give a more dynamic roster that can take losses more readily as sustain heavy wounds on several soldiers without reducing my capacity to perform missions all that much. I still get a few top squads that are as good as they can be and then a few B/C squads.

This way I find uses for a few different types of Assaults to use in different situation. Chain Lightning Assaults are definitely VERY useful in missions with many enemies, LR can also be a thing in such missions if you can bring someone with LR as well as a Chain Lightning Assault. You can gain LR from the AWC on other classes as well.
Post Reply