1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

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Psieye
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1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Mods and tweaks:
- Not Ironman
- Commander's Choice
- Peek from Concealment
- LW2 Information Display
- No Alien Hunters DLC
- XCOMLW_AWCPack.ini - ALWAYSSHOW = true
- Default graze band

Gatecrasher graduates:

HP/Mob/Dge/Aim/Def
3,16,9,60,10 -> Assault. Access to CM, Kubikiri, Hunter's Instincts
3,16,6,62,10 -> Spec (10 Hack). Access to Executioner, Bring Em On, Lethal // Flashbanger, Will to Survive, Implacable
3,16,14,56,8 (14d wounds) -> Grenadier. Access to Resilience, Phantom, Implacable.
3,15,7,70,-2 -> Sniper. Access to Sprinter // Ghostwalker
4,16,1,61,8 -> Technical. Access to CM, Sapper, Hit & Run // EV, Phantom, CCS
3,15,3,67,6 -> Gunner. Access to Boosted Cores, Sapper, Lethal // Smoker, Guardian, Tradecraft
5,14,9,66,0 -> Shinobi. Access to Sprinter, Iron Curtain
5,13,7,62,4 -> Technical. Access to CM, Bring Em On, Full Kit // Deep Cover // Quick Draw, Gunslinger, Clutch Shot, Return Fire

Number of rookies...
with 16 Mob: 7 (and 1 with 17 Mob)
with > 5 Def: 3
with < -5 Def: 4
with >70 Aim: 1
with < 60 Aim: 2
with >10 Dodge: 2
with >9 Hack: 4 (one has 16)
with 5 HP: 2

What a lopsided barracks.


Mar 4, ProtectData, 5d 14h, Str 2
Last edited by Psieye on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 3rd 1.5 Commander campaign

Post by Psieye »

Reserved for Hall of Fame.
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Re: 3rd 1.5 Commander campaign

Post by Psieye »

Haven History:
Start in West Africa, 4 neighbours
Mar 9, contact Black Market
Mar 20, contact East Africa (5 rebels, Str 3, Vig 1)
Mar 22, faceless detected in West Africa

Research History:
Mar 7, Res Comm
Mar 11, Mod Weapons
Mar 15, Buy Scientist - $115
Mar 21, VIP Scientist
Mar 29, VIP Scientist
Mar 31, Basic Research
Apr 4, Hybrid Materials
Apr 6, Alien Biotech
Last edited by Psieye on Sat Dec 16, 2017 8:06 pm, edited 9 times in total.
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Re: 3rd 1.5 Commander campaign

Post by Dwarfling »

Ain't about time you step it up to Legendary?
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SonnyWiFiHr
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Re: 3rd 1.5 Commander campaign

Post by SonnyWiFiHr »

Deleted - It is legendary now
Last edited by SonnyWiFiHr on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Psieye
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Re: 3rd 1.5 Commander campaign

Post by Psieye »

Dwarfling wrote:Ain't about time you step it up to Legendary?
You know what, sure. OP has been updated with the new campaign. I've about done enough experimentation to develop my playstyle. The strategic layer fuckery I want to do, I should test on Legendary to see how feasible it really is.

The first thing I notice is that 0% infil detection radii are larger than ever on Legendary. Even with an SMG, you can't meaningfully advance like this.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Mar 4, ProtectData, West Africa, Str 2. Send 5-man with 2 rookies.

Mar 7, S&G, 3d 19h, West Africa, Str 2, V.Light. That sucks, missing out on a mission at the start.

Mar 9, Contact Black Market. Buy Engineer ($115).

Mar 10, ProtectData in West Asia at 92% infil.

Wounded:
Rookie, 13d

Promotions:
Tech, Assault, Spec -> LCpl
4,16,0,67,-10 -> Spec (16 Hack). Access to DGG, Locked On, Holo Targeting // Infighter, Formidable, CCS
3,16,4,66,-9 -> Grenadier (13d wound). Access to Steady Hands, Kubikiri, Cyclic Fire // Flashbanger

I heard a snek on this mission. Did not see it, spec got a nice hack after opening (then closing) a door.

PoI is 1d supply.

It is Mar 10, 2PM. S&G will expire in 10h.

Cooldowns in West Africa:
ProtectData until at least Mar 24.
S&G until at least Mar 24.
Vig decay on Mar 17.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Mar 13, HighValuePrisoner: Scientist, 7d 16h, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light. Send 6-man with 3 rookies.

Mar 15, scan PoI for $64. Buy Scientist for $110. Begin contacting East Africa.

Mar 15 11PM, switch West Africa to full recruit.

Mar 17, Excavation: $49.

Mar 18 1AM, +1 rebel in West Africa. Set him to Supply to check for Faceless, it's supply drop soon.

Mar 18 11PM, Prisoners (2 rebel, 1 rookie), 5d 20h, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light. Send 5-man with 1 rookie.


That HighValuePrisoner will fire on Mar 21, the haven needs to flip to Intel before Mar 21 7AM.

Mar 20, contact East Africa. Switch West Africa to full Intel.

--- HighValuePrisoner: Scientist ---
Mar 21, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light, 100% infil
Evac is somewhat near VIP

A dull initial 3 turns while tailing a squad that patrolled away. Activated when RNF went yellow and there was a 2nd pod already in sight.

51% hack for Watch List success
Flawless victory

Promotions:
Tech -> LCpl
5,16,-6,62,-7 -> Grenadier. Access to Walk Fire, Aggression, Hunter's Instincts // Guardian, Aim, Tradecraft
3,15,-1,73,-2 -> Sniper. Access to Shadowstrike, Sprinter, Bring Em On // Fortify, Shadowstep, CuP // Quickdraw, Clutch Shot, Fan Fire, Lightning Hands
4,16,-5,66,-10 -> Shinobi.
------
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Mar 22, Supply Drop #1 - Faceless in West Africa

Mar 23, ProtectData: Scientist from City, 8d 11h, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light. Send 5-man with 1 rookie. I do not want this squad tied up for long.


--- Prisoners ---
Mar 24, West Africa, Str 2, 96% infil, V.Light
Evac is beyond prison

Decision: try to semi-stealth this.

Turn 3, 1st pod just walks into the squad. Ok, this turned from stealth into beaglerush opening. Shinobi lost stealth too. Pod 1 is down to a 3 HP Engineer in OW at start of my turn.

A Snek... Fine let's do this. High roll snipe and frag kills it (with loot).

79% hack for small alloy succeeds. This while a pod guarding the jail is right next to a rebel (damn scatter passing through the jail door). The VIPs ran past 3 Advent and the door was shut after the grenadier fragged two. Next turn, that pod had bunched up next to the door (and was OW'ing) when the door opened again to throw another frag, nearly wiping that pod. The surviving 1 HP Trooper got off a shot on the spec, wounding him for 1 below full HP. This grenadier had earlier taken a hit from an Engineer's OW so was at 2 HP.

Wounded:
- Spec: 11d
- Grenadier: 13d

Promotions:
Shinobi, Spec, Grenadier, Sniper -> LCpl
3,16,-3,59,10 -> Spec (9 Hack). Access to Quick Study, Bring Em On, Hit & Run // Flashbanger, Rapid Deployment, LR. This is a heroine in the making.

+2 rebels in West Africa.
3,15,12,68,-2 rookie.
---

Mar 25, S&G, 5d 18h, East Africa, Str 3, V.Light. Send 5-man, no rookies. I can get to 96%, I'm prepared to fight a Light mission. Then again, I'm sending all my best soldiers including all my specs. I'll probably abort this mission.

Mar 25, ProtectData (Relay), 4d 20h, East Africa, Str 3, V.Light. Not happening.

It is Mar 25 1PM, the next GOp in East Africa will spawn on Mar 31 1AM and then Apr 1. So East Africa must be back on intel by Mar 30 7AM. Switch East Africa to recruit.

Mar 26 5AM, Lib 1, 5d 8h, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light. No.

Mar 26, Excavation: $43. No Debris on floor 2, have to start on Alien Machinery (30d).

Mar 27, S&G, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light. Send 7-man, 6 rookies. This might be madness, or it might jump start my rookie training. There are no bad rookies in this batch.

Mar 29 8PM, switch East Africa to intel.

--- ProtectData: Scientist from City ---
Mar 29, West Africa, Str 2, E.Light, 100% infil

Ok wow, that was a lesson in AI: snipe to activate a 2-man pod, killing one. The other STILL DASH SCOUTS, which flanked my shinobi, activating the entire map. Restarted after learning this AI behaviour lesson. The buggy terrain spot was a minor revelation.

Undeserved Flawless victory: even after scumming the mission, I still let a Trooper shoot my assault in the flank. That missed. The highlight was the grenadier landing 3 multi-target frags while never being seen. She got hugged by Snek that ran up to her, but the sniper happened to have moved to the perfect position to shoot that Snek (crit it to death even). The rookie and assault going into hiding threw the AI off.

Scientist VIP.
Loot: Adv Scope

Promotions:
Assault -> Cpl
Grenadier, Sniper, Shinobi -> LCpl
5,15,14,57,0 -> Shinobi. Access to Sprinter, Bombardier, Holo // Deep Cover, Rapid Deployment, CCS. Should go dedicated stealth for the first 3 perks.
---

PoI is 2d for alloy. It is Mar 29, 7PM. I can scan that PoI for 1d then have to scan at East Africa for 4d.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Mar 29, sell cores and a Trooper body. Start building AWC.

Mar 30, Supply Raid, 4d 22h, West Africa. Ok, so that rookie spam S&G might be in for a rough evac. Force should be going up soon too.

--- S&G ---
Mar 31 6AM, East Africa, Str 3, V.Light, 97% infil.
Urban map, 6 crates, evac is near crates

Out with 2 crates. Wretched failure to check how far vision goes exposed sniper to an orange-shot. For a 3 HP unit, 1 damage is a big deal. Knowing it was V.Light, I was cautious in advancing and really 2 specs in a 5-man means I can't be quick. Better than rookies though. The next mission should resolve this lack of non-rookies.

Wounded:
LCpl Sniper, 13d

Promotions:
Spec -> Cpl
Spec -> LCpl

Loot:
- 13 alloy
- +12 Dge PCS
- Life Support PCS
- Hair Trigger
---

Mar 31, Lib 1, 4h, East Africa, Str 3, V.Light.

Mar 31, Basic Research done, begin Hybrid Materials. PoI gives 10 alloy.

Apr 3, +1 rebel in West Africa.

Apr 3, HighValuePrisoner: LCpl Gunner, 8d 14h, East Africa, Str 3, E.Light.

Apr 4, Hybrid Materials done, begin Alien Biotech (because I stupidly sold all my cores so I don't have any elerium for Laser).

--- S&G ---
Apr 5, West Africa, Str 3, V.Light, 99% infil
Force: 3
7-man, mostly rookies

4-crates, evac close to crates.

Abysmal failure - Turret (squadsight) owned the squad. 2 KIA, 3 wounded. One rookie didn't even get promoted. When the Snek showed up, it was time to give up.

Wounded:
Sqd Grenadier, 12d
Rookies: 18d, 14d

Promotions:
3,16,1,59,9 -> Assault. Access to Lone Wolf, Sprinter // EV, Covert, Kill Zone
3,17,-4,62,2 -> Assault. Access to Quick Study, Deadeye, Light Em Up // CF, Evasive, RR // Quickdraw, Return Fire, Lightning Hands, Faceoff. Wants to be a rifle assault.
3,15,12,68,-2 -> Spec. I was going to make him a shinobi but one of the KIA was a 9 Hack recruit. This guy has 7 Hack. Access to Salvo, Sprinter, Light Em Up // Quick Study, Ghostwalker, Rapid Deployment // Return Fire, Lightning Hands, Quickdraw
---

Apr 5, Tactical DE: Combat Awareness

Apr 6, +1 recruit in pool: 4, 13, 0, 74, -8

Apr 6, AWC complete. Send Sqd Assault (9 Def) to learn Lone Wolf.

Apr 6, Lib 1, East Africa, Str 2, E.Light.

Apr 7, Lib 1, West Africa, Str 3, V.Light.

Apr 8, Prisoners, 2d 2h, West Africa, Str 3, V.Light.

Ok WAIT, how did this happen? 10 rebels would take... right there was a 5% chance it wouldn't even have been detected after this long. That's if those 10 were all clean, I know there's at least 1 Faceless.

I think that's this campaign over. I've missed about half the missions now and I fucked up the path to Laser. Should have accepted that missing the first S&G means not getting AWC. Won't start the next campaign immediately, I do have things I should be doing in RL first.

A quick peek with LWToggleShowFaceless tells me there was just 1 Faceless in West Africa. So a lot of bad luck on spawning and detecting missions. Well, these things happen with RNG.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by SonnyWiFiHr »

When I first time Started Long War 2 I started on legendary and played few missions - solo or dual.
(With no perks and any knowledge of mission spawning conditions.)
This is the only reason why I scan with scientist
I had to save scum commander campaign to learn vigilance role

Legendary is - legendary.
Intel & intel ˛& intel. and crappy chance to detect it. I wish that you could do that first S&G in time.
Can you restart and buy scientist first ? I asked because game has forced me to play like this on legendary.
I can save scum but if you have early save why not use it.

Right now I m doing Commander because I have no clue what to do after April 15 and I jumped into hell on March 4 (0% is to much for rookies) to gain - nothing.

I wish you better luck in next one. You know my motto - if you are lucky you are better player
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Jacke »

It's been a while since I tried a LW2 campaign, which were Legendary with much the same mods as Psieye, but with metamodding to improve the quality of rookies (better aim, mobility, no negative defense or dodge, and no 3hp ones). And I've never been able to finish one, with the strategic overhead and getting it right alongside the tactical challenges. Especially when I come up against retaliations, missions I've never gotten the grip on tackling.

I'll likely give it another try sometime soon. I find Psieye's comments on his play helpful, although it takes concentration to get the most out of his words, to properly place them in the context of the game.

But one thing I think I'll never get the hang of is metagaming the implementation and switching rebel jobs in the way he does. It's just too much information to hold in my head in a game where I've got to keep track of so much strategically and tactically. I'll likely focus on Intel to get Intel, with some or most switching to Supply or Recruit when that seems right. In some ways, it just seems wrong to do this sort of metagaming, getting away from being a game representing an insurgency to being a game to min-max to death.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Jacke wrote: I find Psieye's comments on his play helpful, although it takes concentration to get the most out of his words, to properly place them in the context of the game.
I suspected my write-ups were hard to read. Could you give some detail on which contextual information is missing in my posts?
Jacke wrote:metamodding to improve the quality of rookies (better aim, mobility, no negative defense or dodge, and no 3hp ones).
While I'm fine with the tactical state of rookies vs Legendary enemies, I'm not against metamodding - notably the strategic layer. Let's see what XComLW_Activities.ini parameters I'd be interested in tweaking...

FORCE_LEVEL_DETECTION_MODIFIER_LEGENDARY: right, this explains how you can find good missions early on with a tiny haven. On Commander and Legendary, you get a buff to detection chances for the first 35 days or so (i.e. Force < 3). I'm going to make that bonus the same as on Commander. It's an earlygame-only buff, which is significant but can be scummed to reproduce manually and I don't have time to scum lots of campaigns.
RESCUE_SOLDIER_WEIGHT: ok I'm setting that to 0 next time. I don't want a soldier from a HighValuePrisoner. I prefer 'home grown' soldiers than random veterans. That and more scientists/engineers. Might push scientist weight up so engineers still come at the same rate.
POLITICAL_PRISONERS_REBEL_REWARD_MIN: setting that to 4.
[ProtectData X2LWAlienActivityTemplate] - perhaps the most controversial change I'd do: narrowing the duration of ProtectData, HighValuePrisoner, PoliticalPrisoners and Logistics. From 9~13d -> 11d. Back when the Incendiary RNG debate was raging on, I didn't care as "does this target burn?" is a relatively insignificant effect on the whole campaign. A couple bad RNG rolls on mission spawn that can derail the campaign? If I had lots of free time I might accept it, but that's not reality for me.

Also of interest: MAX_GEN_OPS_PER_REGION_PER_MONTH. Seems PI has already thought of GOp scumming and has just about blocked it on Legendary.

Why is TROOP_MANEUVERS_CHANCE_KILL_ALERT at 100 for all difficulties? I thought the patch notes for 1.5 said it'd be 50% for Commander/Legend?
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by SonnyWiFiHr »

; This makes detection easier in regions of certain force levels (which are like tech levels), can be used to ramp up difficulty as alien tech level increases
; Index is difficulty, set to false to turn off all modifiers
+USE_DETECTION_FORCE_LEVEL_MODIFIERS[0] = true
+USE_DETECTION_FORCE_LEVEL_MODIFIERS[1] = true
+USE_DETECTION_FORCE_LEVEL_MODIFIERS[2] = false
+USE_DETECTION_FORCE_LEVEL_MODIFIERS[3] = false

Don't forget this. Legendary [3] set it to true. You have only two weeks of bonus detection anyway.
Force Level is rising after 14 days.
RESCUE_SOLDIER_WEIGHT: 0 is to much sci / eng tried that. Abandoned in my case
POLITICAL_PRISONERS_REBEL_REWARD_MIN = 4 . Full haven if you get two rebels reward and jailbreak. There is max also - it is set to 6
This two are like console command. You wont like it.
MAX_GEN_OPS_PER_REGION_PER_MONTH - expand early - you don't need to tweak that and you are better than I on tactical layer
[ProtectData X2LWAlienActivityTemplate] - same as above.
TROOP_MANEUVERS_CHANCE_KILL_ALERT[0]=100 ; 1.5; This is the % chance winning a troop maneuvers mission will kill an alert point (rookie) - This kills Strength for sure (screw the RNG) you need that
Faceless kills Strength also- you can manipulate both. Live in harmony with faceless until you need to kill Strength

You had bad roll you don't need this tweaks.
You can win without them and have "perfect legendary".
Good legendary start involves extra two scientists - if you detect Jailbreak and rescue eng you are on right path. My answer for everything is screw the research and use scientists to get more - scientist. You can only get eng in first set of missions but this will give better chance to roll Sci on next set of missions.
On Veteran -for Veteran player . You can scan only with Avenger for quite some time and have good mission timers. Bonus of +5% per day is huge and overpowered. It actually screwed my save scumming (testing).
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Psieye
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

That's kinda my point - these tweaks are aimed at the strategic layer to reduce variance. Perhaps it'll be enough with USE_DETECTION_FORCE_LEVEL_MODIFIERS to avoid a campaign sinking from bad strategic RNG in the earlygame. I am very conscious how little time I get lately for playing LW2. That might be a sign I should outright stop playing until life changes again.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by SonnyWiFiHr »

Make your own start. Save on Avenger and then roll.

USE_DETECTION_FORCE_LEVEL_MODIFIERS [3] = true -is 2% you also need to adjust
+FORCE_LEVEL_DETECTION_MODIFIER_LEGENDARY[0]=2 -> 3 is Commander
+FORCE_LEVEL_DETECTION_MODIFIER_LEGENDARY[1]=2 -> 3 is commander

Both Legendary and Commander are disabled by default. My point was - you had bad roll. You were playing without it all your previous campaigns. Haven is 5 or 4 ? One Jailbreak and you will be fine until next squad wipe. :D
7th march is quite late for any difficulty and people will just restart game at this point.
I will quit any campaign with so bad detection so early. It is usually just wasted time.
My Legendary: 5 rookies dead, 6 rookies dead, 6 rookies dead, Squad wipe and squad wipe (16 ) first month
Do you remember my bitching about negative defense insta-kill rookies :lol: :lol:

Sorry about life , hope that will get better .
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Jacke »

Psieye wrote:
Jacke wrote: I find Psieye's comments on his play helpful, although it takes concentration to get the most out of his words, to properly place them in the context of the game.
I suspected my write-ups were hard to read. Could you give some detail on which contextual information is missing in my posts?
It's not you. It's inherently difficult to describe combat well without a lot of background knowledge and graphics. It's worse with XCOM than with real-world combat as there are a lot more variety of different soldier-types. Putting a summary in words usually cuts things down to the minimum possible else you just get too many words. So when reading, I try to picture the game behind the words. As it's been a while since I've played LW2, it's a bit difficult. Even moreso when the talk goes to the underlying implementation details.
Psieye wrote:
Jacke wrote:metamodding to improve the quality of rookies (better aim, mobility, no negative defense or dodge, and no 3hp ones).
While I'm fine with the tactical state of rookies vs Legendary enemies, I'm not against metamodding - notably the strategic layer. Let's see what XComLW_Activities.ini parameters I'd be interested in tweaking...
Nothing wrong with you, but this is the point at while my mind glazes over.

I know the implementation is important. It provides the challenges to the player. As the player's forces increase in number and quality, the forces of ADVENT must also increase in number and quality to maintain challenges. Having a good implementation to deliver the challenges against a changing player force is vital. Thinking about adjusting these parameters to make the game better is good.

But how the player should decide strategy, operations (in XCOM who to send on missions with what kit), and tactics should be determined by the information delivered to the player in the game. Not by digging through the implementation parameters and code. This is just wrong. It's partly caused by the limits of the base XCOM 2 game engine and what Pavonis can do with it. Some things, like the limit on GOps in a particular zone over a given time period, are likely there to prevent issues. But influencing the player's play by knowing them is just wrong.

I've seen Xwynns do kind-of similar things on a tactical level, exploiting the AI driving Advent and kind of knowing how they will react to his tactical moves. But that's not quiet so exploitable as it sometimes goes wrong.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by Psieye »

Jacke wrote:this is the point at while my mind glazes over.

I've seen Xwynns do kind-of similar things on a tactical level, exploiting the AI driving Advent and kind of knowing how they will react to his tactical moves. But that's not quiet so exploitable as it sometimes goes wrong.
Yeah, I've certainly stopped being a player and stepped into the realm of a developer when I'm digging this deep in. I blur the line as I still derive enjoyment whether I'm being a player or a commentating-developer: there's sufficient RNG in the algorithms that I'll never have perfect "prophesies" of how the future will play out. On the tactical level, it's why I lean towards snipers a lot: if a pod is active, I consider that 'controlled' as they're now behaving predictably. An orange-alert pod I can't see is scary, an active pod is 'safe' with sufficient preparation.
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Re: 1st 1.5 Legendary campaign

Post by SonnyWiFiHr »

I have more than 75 aim Advent on map vs rookies. It is just crazy if you try 0% inf on Legendary -test ride .
I really did not plan to play Legendary - with my mods .
I had to many research to do. I will get lasers in May and ETC weapons cost is abnormal - 400-500 supply.
Will see how my test ride will end ( 8 rookies vs single drone and drone is down to one HP) I should disable realistic panic behavior for sure.
It seems that Legendary do not play well with my favorite mods.

@ Pseye
4 days last detection is normal. Only few should give less. This can happen on Commander also (when you detect Lib before normal mission).
Enabling extra detection is fine. But be warned you still can get crappy times it is pure RND.
Jailbreak is most important early mission. Without it - it is hard to leave 1st region.
I have hard time to detect so low timers - they are rare but possible. I don't know why they disabled extra detection - my guess is to make game even harder but it only hurts when you get S&G or any revealed start missions.

S&G is big loss but skipping Eng is even more - forcing you to lose soldiers in attempt to do something.
Why are Lamp Post smarter than my Specialist ? If loot is in Lamp post why not just blast it ? Is hack = IQ ?
I should equip my specialist with blowtorch, that flying drone is not good for hacking. Leaver and drilling machine will be even better.
Burglar class ?
And sound of hacking is just annoying.
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